CA M15a4 or G&P M4?
 

So I want to buy a new full metal armalite style aeg. My main concerns are the gearbox, the quality of the receiver, and compatibility with after market parts.

so the two i keep running into in my price range are the classic army m15 series, and g&p m4s.


from my research, g&p seems to have the better externals, but the more problematic gear box.

so which would be a better buy? or should i start from scratch and just buy a good metal receiver?

Personally i love all CA stuff. they are really built strong and nice and heavy.
check this
http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=92222

I have a collection of CA guns and they work great. You will be pleased.

The only Armalites I've had were CA's. Great guns and aside from aesthetic mods they all ran stock and all ran perfectly fine for thousands of rounds. I was in the same boat as you, G&P vs. CA but in the end the availability of CA's vs. G&P's swayed my favor.

Thats a controversial subject and highly dependent on how good of a day the factory is having.
I've seen CA's last 2 years, I've seen them last 2 games, and I've seen them come broken in box.
Just as well I've seen the same out of G&Ps, some last 2 years, some last 2 games, I've heard of them coming broken in box but never seen it myself.

But really if your going to upgrade the internals anyway, G&P is the way to go. Best get the most solid externals you can right away since that's the REALLY expensive part.
But there's a trick to G&Ps that will maximize their lifespan, SHIM THE GEARS BEFORE USING IT.
#1 issue on G&P's is gear shafts breaking, I shimmed an M16A3 before use, it went through well over 40,000 rounds and a year and a half without anyone opening it before it came back to me. Only problem was the barrel got bent and the piston head was about to break, gears were fine.

I own both brands, I'd rather go CA

I fielded that M16A3 ThunderCactus is referring to for about 6-7 skrims, and i've owned a couple CA M4's before. I'll never go back to CA, That M16A3 was a force to be reckoned with, even with a 7.2 battery.

My advice, is go with the G&P.

Id say get what ever one you like the looks of best. You will be upgrading it anyway, dont even fool yourself that you wont.

A couple of people are going to chime in and say "OH I've been playing 5 yrs with the same gun stock, and its great I see no need to upgrade."

These people are still on there first bag of bbs, and delusional.

...and killed over and over again by upgraded guns when they play. neither brand lasts long out of the box. if you want reliable performance without having to open your gun before playing get a tm or a systema. the japanese seem to actually understand and care about stock parts cooperating for a long time out of the box.

Yes and if you do go with TM and want to keep it stock, and you don't mind the M14. GO WITH THE M14! Hands down best stock AEG i've ever fired.

My first gun was a TM - the gears shredded when running a 9.6
I disposed of that abomination and bought a CA. Never looked back.

Ditto. Got a brand new TM M4A1. Laster a whole 1000 or so rounds before the gears decided to snack on themselves. I was running a 2000 mAh 9.6V nunchuck battery. I'm sure the rate of fire was no more than 15 / sec. Got a new set of gears (Modify Modular), and within less than another 1000 rounds, the mechbox snapped (still on stock spring, never dry fired needlessly either). So yeah, my faith in TM got shattered from the start.

But my second AEG, my CA M15 - was fired on a 9.6V from the first day. Never had an issue with it. It went at least 40000 rounds before being opened for first servicing and a spring upgrade. At the same time, I added a Systema spring guide, tappet plate, piston, piston head and cylinder head. But really, other than the spring, none of the stock parts needed replacement.

Within about 500 rounds (lasted 1 game), the Systema piston exploded. I replaced it with the stock CA piston. Within another couple of hundred rounds, the tappet plate broke. I replaced it with the original CA tappet plate. This was at the beginning of last summer. That gun's been my main gun since for outdoor games, and it's still running and hasn't been opened.

So other than the Systema silent cylinder / piston head set, spring (MS110SP @ 385 fps) and a Modify nozzle, that gun is still running all stock parts and has seen a minimum of 60000 rounds in its lifetime. And it hasn't given me the slightest problem. The gun has seen many external mods since (converted to a C7A2 including Guarder receiver), but internally it's still going strong.

so thats 5 for ca, 2 for g&p and 2 for tm,

tm is out becase i want a metal body.

so this hasn't become easier a decision, but you guys have given me really good info to consider.

My TM G3 was a tank, kept firing after the mechbox shell broke, only lost 5fps and it didnt damage the hop chamber lol
And anything CA makes, G&P also makes, G&P is the M4 whore of the airsoft gun companies. They make dozens of M4 variants lol
They also make RIS systems that don't freaking WOBBLE. Screw you CA and your wobbly RIS!

ca has issues with wobble?

You do know that stock TM M4 only use a 8.4 mini. when you run the 9.6 nunchucks your chance of shreding the internals almost doubled.

Ratnest, whether its G&P or CA neither of them are better that the other out of the box, the QA are a hit and miss. Like Manchovie said both are nice AEG but still need a bit of work as for asthetics the G&P are better but for metal body construction I have to lean towards the CA they use a slightly heavier metal and are known to be a bit more robust than G&P (I have broke both bodies before)
Another choice that you might consider is a higher priced point King Arms Complete AEG their M4 series are quite nice (I have their Troy CQB, Noveske)

*Edit* The first thing that broke on my G&P SR25 was one of the spur gear, it broke right on the axle, next was the piston and all this was by the second game and maybe 200 rnds

Earlier CA bodies have horrible fitting issue, but the newer ones are good, I had a chance to fondle a New BNIB CA M15 a few days ago and I have to say their QA are improving the fitment issue are gone

Like I said, you need to shim G&P gears or they break right away. They have weak gears but everything else is good

First you gotta ask yourself if you want to upgrade anything other than cosmetics.

I have a CA M15A4 I spent a little more than $1900 on it including the gun. Yes I know, I could have gotten other things.

Long story short, BRAND NEW IN BOX WITH GROUNDED GEARS (new gears installed), next... piston nozzle broke (new piston), then... tappet plate snaps (new tappet plate), new 150 spring... blah blah blah... the only thing that is stock is the motor and gear box.

Pros:
I admit that CA has really nice metal bodies and tight secure rings for your foregrip and their solid construction. Solid as a rock

G&P respond better and their lighter in weight slightly.

Cons:
CA: Internals not as great.

G&P: External not as great.

I dont know if CA has changed their paint in the last year, but G&P has always had a nicer (less shiny) finish to it as well

I had the chance to handle a BRAND NEW 2009 model G&P... and I must say the metal used and the finish is a much higher quality than recent CA.

If you have unlimited funds, go for a G&P, CA is the more "Budget" version in my opinion.

I've put a crap-load of money into a complete overhaul of a very old CA M15A4, and I've had no fitment issues at all...

Yeah, I realize that. I didn't at the time, but I do now. The point I was trying to make is that out of the box, CA have much stronger and better guns than TM for the same money. They can take upgraded springs, large batteries, etc without any other foolery required.

TM mechbox and gears are shitty metal. They're ok at 280 fps with small batteries, but otherwise, gears are shit. And their mechbox shells are weak and suck IMO. I'd never waste another penny on a TM AEG. The only TM AEG that I can easily say is vastly superior in every way to the 'equivalent' model on the market is the M14. Otherwise, I'd take a JG over any TM and just reshim and make the small upgrades required and I'd have a better gun.

But back on topic, I'm a big fan of CA. :D

Actually some TM gears in an AK have held up to ~380fps quite well.
The metal isn't bad, but I think that the V2 mechbox is indeed too weak to be using TM metal.

Well in their defense, the TM's were never actually meant to be used over 300fps (Japanese laws). So despite being ultra tough at 300fps, they have a high tendency to break down REAL quick over 350fps

Thus you'd have to replace EVERYTHING on the inside to go past 350 and eventually everyone wants a metal body... That's why I say sell your used TM when your done with it and buy a whole other gun, much cheaper lol

This I'll have to agree with 100%. They were never intended for anything other than their stock velocities and an 8.4V battery. Upgrading a TM is a rather expensive path if you want both performance and durability. You really are better off buying a new, full metal gun as an upgrade.